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Part-timer debate turns transaction-specific

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Real Estate Professional | 11 Nov 2014, 09:27 AM Agree 0
Are selling agents better than buying ones?

That question seems to be leading the latest reincarnation of the part-timer debate, as more agents are willing to accept their part-time counterparts, provided they keep to the “less complicated” buying side of the transaction.
  • | 12 Nov 2014, 03:44 PM Agree 0
    Define "part time"! Lots of top agents have other "interests" and are not in the office every day. Others might be holding a full time (again needs defintion). To obtain a licence registrants have to take courses and then more courses to get full qualifications. Lots of teh so -called "full timers" are lacking in knowledge and still need mentoring and coaching. Also, what is the Broker of Record (of thei sles manager) for? It is their responsibilty to guide and check registrants as they work. Are our offices becoming too big so that sales reps are more or less wandering around aimlessly? Are our offices becoming like "puppy mills". That is NOT a statement - it is a question!
  • kingkong | 12 Nov 2014, 04:31 PM Agree 0
    This debate statements that part timers need disclosure is none sense. What the client should be asking as a question is "will you pick up my call or attend my needs in buying or selling a house?" if that agent can confidently says yes and provide you reference and genuine testimonial then part time full time question is irrelevant. This applies to full time agents too because not all full time agents can give out reference to call or testimonial to back up themselves. There a lot of savvy professionals who works from home and bored out of their mind and they take on another challenge and become a realtors. They already have soft skills and very well verse in management and customer service. Some are professionals who belongs to other profession such as accounting, IT, consultant, management etc. Which they don't need to be tied in to their desk 8 hours a day. Some are higly paid professionals become realtor for the reason of tax break offsetting their income tax. End of the day don't hate on part timers because most of them professionals are smart enough to manage their time wisely and make more money on two profession at the same time which a traditional realtor could not do.
  • | 12 Nov 2014, 09:22 PM Agree 0
    I wouldn't get an operation from a part time Surgeon.

    Real Estate has got to be the easiest industry to get in to.

    Increase fees and...

    Have a vote to reverse the ability to hold another profession. But please, hold the vote during the day!
  • PO'd | 13 Nov 2014, 11:59 AM Agree 0
    Appear the first 2 posts were from part-timers. I'm with committing to what you do best rather than providing advice on what you think you know.

    And yes.... Agree..... Increase fees ($5,000 p/yr). Have the vote for those who have committed to being a full time realtor (their career & livelihood). Vote only if they've been in real estate full time for at least 5 years.

    A large increase in fees must also restrict the bodies/organizations we support from handing out licenses to everyone like candy.

    Funny how we support organizations and the people we employ in them, provide them with benefits, retirement packages and we/they can't do that for us. YET, they control those who feed them. Just like politics ...... we put them there to look after our best interest and they tell us what to do!!!!

    PEOPLE --- wake up. Without us these organisations and the people they/we employ wouldn't be there. WHAT WE WAITING FOR?
    I suppose we deserve what we're getting.
  • Maxy | 13 Nov 2014, 01:37 PM Agree 0
    When this debate about part timers bubbled up about two months ago, it was clear what the motive was or is. Are part time teachers bad teachers? Are part time plumbers bad plumbers? When scrutinized, the complaining full timers may have other jobs they do not even know they have. The advocates against so called part timers are definitely not concerned about clients' interests. First they blamed part timers, then they blamed brokers for signing on many new agents, then they complained that entry grade should be bumped up to may be 110 % and the list goes on. I wonder the Real Estate exam they wrote and the grades they made. I know excellent agents who barely finished high school. It is a virtue to reflect on ones motives and attitude towards others. The me, I and myself mentality definitely does not build a community. The self proclaimed experts should go and listen to the Massey Lecture given by Madame Adrienne Clarke, aired on CBC on November 12, 2014. There is a saying that you do not legislate good ethics. We preach free market forces when it serves our purpose and when it does not we preach restrictive regime. We all have seen many new and "experienced" agents come and go. There is no data, in public domain, showing that "part timers" do not serve their clients well. There is no doubt that the whiners are fighting for their wallets and not for the clients. My take on the debate is, any agent who thinks there are too many agents in the industry should quit and the too many will be too many less one. Any Broker who thinks there are too many Brokerages should close shop and there will be too many brokerages less one. Agents who are struggling know when to throw in the towel. They do not need the "experienced gurus" to push them out. Let us live together. Our world has room for all who play fair.
  • Maxy | 13 Nov 2014, 01:47 PM Agree 0
    Advocating increase in fees to $5,000.00 justifies what I wrote earlier that the people complaining about part timers are not interested in the welfare of clients. How will $5,000.00 fee help an agent serve a client better and the author of that fee increase would not even sign his or her name on the post. REP should not allow anonymous posts on this site.
  • Columbo | 13 Nov 2014, 02:25 PM Agree 0
    Oh dear! This argument again rears its head! In over 60 years in this business FULL TIME I have heard it all - "There are too many in the business". - "Now there are even some women going into in the business (1954)" -"too many part timers - they sell their relatives and then nothing else -(did this guy think HE would sell the guys relatives?) I have never never heard -"There are not enough people in the business!". This is supposed to be a free enterprise country . I never cared how many were in it-part-timers or full timers. If the part timers did very little business , who cares? I was raising a family and had to work hard and and I did- successfully. Comparing this to a "part time surgeon is ludicrous . How many operations does a surgeon have to do to be "safe" -I suspect that after a surgeon does 10 appendectomies, s/he knows how to do it and s/he may then decide to only do appendectomies or whatever and then would by definition become "part time". Oh and just one more thing - let's remember that this is not really a "profession". As long as we run our butts off, looking for listings, and showing houses, and offering advice, give market value evaluations all for FREE and get paid only if a sale results,like car salesmen, or insurance salesmen or appliance salesmen then we are not a true "profession". We are a BUSINESS and I make no apologies for that! I love business and business people. I do however conduct my business very PROFESSIONALLY. Maybe some day we will get paid on a fee basis for our knowledge and expertise and not have to depend on just making a sale. That would be nice wouldn't it!
  • Shirley | 13 Nov 2014, 11:55 PM Agree 0
    The only ones that whine about part timers are the ones that is hurting for business! Who cares if there are thousands part timers! Maybe the argument for full time agents or any agents in general should be make themselves valuable. There are no correlation between increasing a fee to 5000 to raise the bar of customer service. And the surgeon analogy? What the heck was that about - you can really tell if someone is biased and lack of education thereof. I'm a full time agent for 24 years and I've done many deals with many part timers and some of them did crappy job and some of them really shine better than most full timers I know. Here is the difference the ones part timers that shine possessed a great interpersonal skills and most of them held a prominent position in their own industry. How I know this? I Linkedin them! I will leave at this quote "Those that quack too much has a weaknesses in them!"
  • Shirley | 14 Nov 2014, 12:09 AM Agree 0
    One more thing I forgot to mention in my 24 years in real estate industry I can also count full timers including producers who is unethically aggressive, lack of communication/interpersonal skills, violated REBBA code of ethics and had been sued in the transaction! I have also done many deals with full time wonderful agents. So since the author is genius in making this arguments do the math and stats of part time vs full time agents that were fined or reprimanded by RECO. Those should be on REP article and not this gibberish childish nonsense!
  • TonyT | 14 Nov 2014, 12:52 PM Agree 0
    You really have to wonder if some of the people posting and defending part-timers are not actually part-timers themselves.
    I'm not for or against part-timers. Simply put, the part-timer has less vested into calling the business a career since their bread, butter and warm soup comes from their primary job. Real estate is then simply bonus money and with little emotion as the sole way they support their livelihood and family.
    "A level playing field" or "Our world has room for all who play fair" as a couple of you mention is fine it that were the case. Unfortunately this industry has failed to put into place a fair play structure. Competition Bureau you say? Ok! The Bureau is a recent issue. What was the reason before the Bureau? Lack of foresight in part of our industry?
    A open eyed look at the business indicates that those with another income do and can more easily charge significantly less for the service than those whose sole business is real estate.
    And yes full timers are doing that as well. Why? Are they forced to compete because its lose a listing or do it for less or loose the listing? Why then are some offering money back to a buyer? Level playing field you say!!??
    Licenced since 1985 (29yrs), I have seen 6% go down to 5%, maybe, 4% and the mere posting. Many will rave that they still always get their 5%. Really!!?? Always??
    Yes, I get 5% from a lot of my clients. Call it quality of service and trust. But, the larger number that have known me and have been clients for ever don't really care. They look at the bottom line. Their kids now care even less. New business doesn't care. They see the ads trying to sell them on the 1% listing fee.
    I don't have any issue with part-timers or anyone else, but let us put in place that level playing field and bring on all who play fair. Until then ........
  • Shirley | 14 Nov 2014, 02:05 PM Agree 0
    Nothing is really justified up to this point. How is being part time has less vested interest? How can you generalize part timers has less vested interest? Most agents brand new ones started as part time like myself because they have mortgage to pay and family to feed. They go in full time when their business become sustainable. I have a successful career managing stocks and portfolios as a stock broker for the bank for 10 years before I became a Realtor so I understand the game of real estate before I became full time. 6% 5% 4% 3% commission is due to competition not because of part timers. This is one of the reason why competition bureau is after real estate market because of this dinosaur thinking that only full timers should have rights and no one else.
  • Tom | 19 Nov 2014, 02:44 PM Agree 0
    What's the definition of "full-time"? Doing 12 transactions a year? 24? 30? Having been in the business for almost a decade, I can tell you that if I don't do 24 real estate transactions in a year, then I am not working at the business "full-time." At the point of 30, then I'd need to hire an assistant - then we'd need to get up to about 48 transactions to make both of us "full-time."

    I can't for the life of me understand the comment about the buyer side being "less complicated". In my experience, there is FAR more work, effort and research that needs to be completed by a buyer's agent than the seller's agent in doing what is legally expected of them when they represent a buyer in the transaction through an agency relationship.
  • Shirley | 21 Nov 2014, 01:22 PM Agree 0
    I totally agree 100% buyer side is far more complicated than seller agency and far more leg work and research is involved. Bottom line of the story is (part time/full time) is subjected on the individual themselves on what they are willing to give or do for their client above and beyond their clients wildest expectation.
  • Frustrated | 22 Nov 2014, 01:31 PM Agree 0
    As a full time Realtor, my issue of dealing with a part-time Realtor is their availability - or lack of availability. Because a part-time realtor has another job or other interests, their focus is not 100% on their real estate business. This means, when entering into a transaction, they are not available or fully focused on that real estate transaction. I know .... I have dealt with part-time realtors and this has been my experience. Personally I don't care if they are part-time or full-time. But if they are part-time, they still have to honour the same fiduciary duties to their client and to other realtors as if they were full-time. They owe that to their client and to me and my client. It is very frustrating for the full-time realtor and everybody else involved when the part-time realtor is only half there. When you have to wait 8 hours for a return phone call from the part-time realtor (because they are busy at their other job), this just isn't acceptable when you are trying to put together a transaction. When you have to schedule everything necessary in a transaction according to the part-time realtor's "other" job as an engineer in Ft McMurray, this just isn't acceptable. It is a nightmare to those of us who devote our full-time efforts to getting the job done.
  • Chuck | 24 Nov 2014, 02:24 PM Agree 0
    The problem I see hear is that of not " part time or full time " it is that of realtors keeping up with the current changes in the laws that govern real estate , contacts and ethics . I suspect that when agents get into " trouble " it is the result of not keeping up to date on these matters ( discounting of course agents who are unwilling and any amount of training would be a waste of time).
  • Ken Bisson | 13 Dec 2014, 02:51 PM Agree 0
    Many Sellers also hold 9-5 jobs and are only available to meet during the evenings and weekends. My business is split between Buyers and Sellers. It is my belief that a fully competent and rounded realtor works both sides of the market to gain professional knowledge and skill. Whether one side of the equation is easier than the other fully depends on circumstances.
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