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Agents push back against TREB warning letter

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Real Estate Professional | 11 Mar 2015, 09:31 AM Agree 0
Times, they are a-changing, and some agents say no warning letter from the Toronto Real Estate Board can stop the eventual shift to publicly available sold data.
  • Realty to Reality | 11 Mar 2015, 11:36 AM Agree 0
    Said it perfectly not pay for their information but for their knowledge!!! The info agent is worth 1,000 abd knowledge agent is is worth 2000-3000. He better have estensive knowledge in litigation,construction,legal etc
  • Kathy | 11 Mar 2015, 11:50 AM Agree 0
    This is a RECO issue! Section 36 of the Code of Ethics.
  • | 11 Mar 2015, 12:01 PM Agree 0
    Our knowledge is based on our access to information and we pay for the system that holds that information. Properties with special circumstances and items not seen in person by both members of the public and REM could skew the sold data.
  • | 11 Mar 2015, 12:26 PM Agree 1
    After 33 years at this, and having sold around 2000 properties, and still sell close to 100 a year, I have no fear of release of sold info to the public. To show value, release all we know and let them try to sell it themselves. I offer all my sellers the option of selling their home themselves after establishing a CMA value. Heck, kijiji is free to post. Thousands of views per week. I offer mere posting at $755.00 to post on MLS and let them deal with the buyers and agents themselves. My average right now is about 90% still tell me to sell their homes for them at my regular rates of commission. I really do believe I have the expertise to advise them how to get the most for their old home and get the best deal on their buy. If they feel they can do better, go for it. You have no real value if it is easily done. I also tell people they can build{subcontract} their own new home and could save $75,000. They still hire the contractor in the vast majority of the cases. Your value is not in information, it is in Real estate adviser expertise, as we do this 8-12 hours a day.
  • David Z | 11 Mar 2015, 12:28 PM Agree 0
    It is obviously time to return to unorganized real estate. Realtor's invested the time, money and efforts to organize information so realtors could service the consumer professionally. Now it is expected that these systems belong to the public is absurd. I would love to go to a high tech auto shop and use their equipment and facilities to perform my own auto repairs. Many repairs are simple with the right tools and equipment. That would save me thousands in car maintenance. Shut down Close down all mls systems and then let the consumers hunt though piles of internet debris for the information they desire.
  • | 11 Mar 2015, 12:47 PM Agree 0
    i don't believe this is an issue of whether the data is mad available to the general public. It's more of the 'when' it's made available. I understand some websites are issuing it as soon as it is reported to TREB. I do not believe that information should be made public at that time because that is not an official price till that property closed. I do not believe this topic should be discussed without the timing issue as part of it. Maybe the privacy commission should sit down with the competitions bureau and work out their crap before any further discussion.
    Price is public information after the deal closes. I do believe realtors who want to make the information available to the general public should be able to buy not before closing.
  • Ryan | 11 Mar 2015, 01:06 PM Agree 0
    I don't think it's a section 36 issue. the Listing brokerage gets the seller to consent to online advertising on the MLS data sheet. IMO it is clearly a gate keeper issue. its the same with every industry when online options become available; the 'gatekeepers" cry foul because they don't want to let the cat out of the bag. Don't fix what ain't broke mentality!. this will only work for so long, eventually the industry will move forward with online tools and services that work well and are useful. I do however, believe that the data should be "contained" within brokerage and agent websites. the VOW channel is an excellent way to provide useful online tools and information while retaining the brokerage-agent-customer pipeline. The bigger issue may be that if TREB included sales data in their datafeed they also run the risk of becoming just a licenser of MLS data, opening up mirror Stratus systems from third party IT providers through CRM systems. Status is a big part of what they do and they may be reluctant to give up the golden goose! I think moving away from in house stratus is the smart move and the sooner the better. large monolithic organizations just can't cut it with the pace of IT these days, in fact their would probably be a significant savings if TREB stopped pouring money into status and simply licenced full MLS data to third parties, Let them charge 40/ month for an all in one CRM system and kicked back the board $10 for the info.

  • REALITY | 11 Mar 2015, 01:33 PM Agree 0
    The commission structure is out of whack these days no matter what. HOME VALUES HAVE INCREASED NOT WHAT THE AGENT IS OFFERING OR THEIR VALUE. They act like they invented the wheel. They look up resales,tour guide,taxi and door opener. Please tell me the magic...Lawyers prices have not risen for closing,stagers,advertisers, etc...the agent got a freee ride and should be happy they got away with the bloated fees.
  • Jim Shelton Re/max | 11 Mar 2015, 03:30 PM Agree 0
    I always will remember approx. 20 years ago - a highly competitive competition for a particular listing. The seller was getting 7 presentations. I realized I'd have to do something unique to be successful. So, rather than recommend a listing price I presented the highly educated university professor seller with all the CMA research documents and asked him to determine his own list price.
    I got the listing - he chose a price that was just short of being "off the chart"!
    I eventually got the property sold - but allowing him to choose his list price sure slowed the process down and created Super frustration in all involved.
    Sold info requires a high amount on interpretation.
  • Premier | 11 Mar 2015, 06:28 PM Agree 0
    Easy FIx.... Setup up the system to pull sales information
    Through CMA"s only.... And limit by postal code
    Make it Troublesom

  • Dinasour | 11 Mar 2015, 06:32 PM Agree 0
    Jimmy is using dinasour responses..!! we are living in the internet age of instant info and buyers /sellers miraculously figured out that realtors look up resales and aim for that on listing and selling . They tour and open doors and want 4-5%!!!!!!! 20 years ago a house price and commission was probably still inflated but much more reasonable ratio.....

    Make a realtor 4 year course on litigation,construction,legal and maybe they are worth 0 .5%- 0.75% /transaction ...3 month multiple questionnaire course and u are touring!!!

    The monopoly on tin,rubber,oil all had monopolies...why would realtors think they keep theirs
  • Mark Huang (GTA) | 11 Mar 2015, 08:19 PM Agree 0
    As a 12-year agent, I have got lots calls from potential clients to ask for the sold prices. Then I find their needs and eventually I can get a deal. If the data is made public, it will reduce my businesses greatly, for sure. When they get the data, they think they understand it fully and will not call us for correct interpretation. Their decision based on wrong interpretation of the sold data would be negative to their own interests.
  • Tom S | 11 Mar 2015, 11:09 PM Agree 0
    REP magazine's objective is to disturb waters in order to drive traffic to their website.

    Who is David Fleming that his opinion matters?
  • Agent A | 12 Mar 2015, 12:35 PM Agree 0
    Why is everyone so hyped up about commissions? Years ago when prices were much lower and the commissions were
    at 6 percent total, very few sellers complained about it. They happily paid for the expertise and hard work of the realtors. Why now, when thanks to hard working, motivating realtors, selling prices have quadrupled and sellers are getting prices that make their eyeballs pop, and flip properties every few years while making a smooth profit, are they complaining about the commission. You don't hear complaints from those sellers making big bucks. Commissions have always been negotiable. When the economy tanks, and interest rates rise up like hot air balloons and sellers have trouble selling their properties, they will be very happy to retain professional realtors. Most agents have websites, and on them are usually tons of "testimonials" from satisfied and happy clients, who supposedly paid commissions.
    The idea that realtors should garner expertise in fields like law, construction, engineering and such, is unrealistic. they could never master all of these subjects to the point of being able to advise. Having real estate salespersons give someone critical advice on such topics would keep the Supreme Court bogged up till Kingdom come. You can look up any topic on the internet whether legal or medical, but not all information is correct and may lead to damages. You still need your doctor, lawyer etc. with credentials.
    Our government is skewed. They tie up realtors' hands with laws preventing agents from calling people (do not call list), as well as calling on expired listings, on the basis of "privacy", but want to give all private sales information to the public freely. Where's the privacy? Agents provide sales data to potential clients anyways and for free now, when under certain conditions, market evaluation or listing presentation appointments. And, yet we are forcibly spoonfed commercials for at least 10 minutes out of every TV show, marketing to us to tell us what toothpaste to buy etc....I should be able to opt out of that too!
  • Vegas | 12 Mar 2015, 01:40 PM Agree 0
    Agent A do u mean ur expertise has inflated the value of properties because they will fall?? Sounds like a wonder the trust and value of realtors provide are roll of the dice. So ..I agree why pay those fees for a service that sounds like Vegas...

    Skill is Bidding Wars that created ur inflation...genius work....educated upgrade for ur level would be a struggle..
  • U.R Trumped | 12 Mar 2015, 05:04 PM Agree 0
    why don't you go into realestate....
  • Jack | 15 Mar 2015, 06:32 PM Agree 0
    Since when data is free? The record of sold properties, in Alberta for example, is a public record. All you have to do is pay $10, per title search, to access that information, through the Alberta Registries and the land title office. Imagine building a data set, at $10 per pop. and then offering it free on your website. Good business plan?

    All this non-sense about free public data is just that: nonsense.

    It took a lot of money through the membership fees to pay for this data.

    Now you have a few agents who decided to cash in on this data, by sitting, on their rear ends, in front of a computer. If, as the so called experts claim, this data does become “free,” it will quickly degrade in quality and become junk data. Whom will this serve?
  • FREE THE DATA | 15 Mar 2015, 11:39 PM Agree 0
    Of course all the finance info on corporations in the stock market that is FREE ONLINE ruined the info!! Corp info sounds like a lot more data than few house sales!!!!!
  • BrokenIndustry | 16 Mar 2015, 11:51 AM Agree 0
    When you pay your dues and fee's you agree to abide by the rules and regulations. You don't like them then change them but flagrantly abusing them because you feel you're some hero to the public is BS. The public will have more trust in us as an industry when we act like an industry and not a bunch of cowboys firing from the hip.
  • Broken | 16 Mar 2015, 04:18 PM Agree 0
    Called greed and overcharging
  • Ryan | 16 Mar 2015, 09:06 PM Agree 0
    The article nailed it ✔️
    The lines of value can get even more destorted than they already are in the publics eye! when a realtor looks at sales data they don't just see a sold number & they certainly don't just pick a house that looks the same on the same street. The act of actually dissecting data and imputing that of at least 3 comparable properties into a comparison worksheet is the missing equation. Real Estate Appraisal is not like comparing tv or electronic prices online. We use equations to Plus & Minus- for the actual value i.e. extra bedroom, finished basement, all fixtures and finishes, is it backing onto a ravine or the house across from it, how about the 'affective age' of i.e. the roof or furnace; this equation starts with the full price of the i.e. furnace divided by the life span (25) years then multiplied by the remanning life to find its value & one of the most important and often overlooked is the time calculations i.e. it sold 4 months ago; what is the equation for market increase/decrease per month, multiplied by time since sold. These are courses that we take to appraise the Value of Real Property properly!
    All of these cost adjustments can't be done properly or probably willingly by the consumer searching for a home and therefor the lines of true value get even more distorted. We as realtors need to be allowed to do our job and be relied upon to represent the consumers interest not only in evaluating property but with contracts and negotiations. There's nothing worse than paying too much or accepting too little for your home. Factors like Appraisal, Contract Law, listing strategy, marketing techniques, Conditions to add or cross out, knowledge of the community and the homes within it along with networking are what your Realtor will bring to the table and they will separate Emotions from the sale. Emotions, unprofessionalism and a lack of knowledge are what get most sellers who use a 'self listing' service into trouble.

    Do you know what to do to protect yourself in every situation i.e. what conditions to add? are you fully versed in property and contract law? Do you know how to properly appraise the value of a home using one of the three principles? Are you insured for errors and omissions i.e. home owners who list their homes are far more liable for errors and things that they didn't disclose than a realtor. Realtors act as your shield when trading in Real Estate. Would a Spartan go into battle without his shield and knowledge of battle? If you are thinking of trading in Real Estate, Just call a Pro & Rest Easy :) After all professionals are there to make our lives easier.. Delegating is the key to success, for we are only one and there are many!
  • Realtor should be called Reality | 20 Mar 2015, 09:42 AM Agree 0
    analyzing is worth 20,000-50,000?? My accountant does all my taxes for 2500 and he anylyses a hell of a lot more than looking at some resales and comparables etc!!

    In ur thnking accountants should be charging 100,000!!!!
  • Jackie Laurin | 23 Mar 2015, 02:48 PM Agree 0
    We pay fees to many organizations/ boards etc. related to our industry. Not to mention information is valuable.
    The public unlicensed agents should pay a reasonable fee to obtain the same information we pay to stay in business.
    There's no free ride.
  • Changes | 24 Mar 2015, 02:59 PM Agree 0
    Greed and the monopolies. The role of information is changing and only monopolies who charge fees in their model fight to keep it.
    The transaction of trading residential real estate is not rocket science. Especially condos, there are 4 walls,doors and a status certificate. Anything else is not guaranteed no matter what agents will tell you. ..another point values of realestate for sale or sold was established mostly by the previous prices... where is the genius in looking up the resales on the computer!!!???

    Commission wars and Price wars.... more commission wars
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