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Sold data breaches infuriate agents

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Real Estate Professional | 01 May 2015, 09:38 AM Agree 0
“Desperate,” “unprofessional,” “self-serving” – agents aren’t holding back in criticizing colleagues who broadcast MLS sold data.
  • Nate | 01 May 2015, 12:23 PM Agree 0
    Many put themselves first, for personal gain. That's the truth.
  • | 01 May 2015, 12:30 PM Agree 0
    Separates the boys from the men? Could that line be more ridiculous in this day and age? Guess there aren't any women who sell real estate!
  • Jackie | 01 May 2015, 12:32 PM Agree 0
    I'd stop decrying change and transgressions and recognize that the business
    Is changing. I'm not sure how these agents who transgress the rules are really
    benefitting as we, who conduct ourselves with integrity and professionalism
    Will always overcome any challenge!
  • Feedback | 01 May 2015, 12:35 PM Agree 0
    Olivia only writes articles that infuriate agents. You would think that she could come up with something Value Added FOR Realtors based on the name of the publication. Hey Olivia, how about running some articles on what good agents do to make the customer happy. Like perhaps the RealtorCare program or the new rules that we have in place to help our customers??? How about new ways to market or tips on who is buying. That would be helpful to Real Estate Professionals and not fodder for sad-sac readers that like to stir the pot. Thanks and enjoy your day!
  • | 01 May 2015, 12:46 PM Agree 0
    34 year veteran here. No issues for me releasing sales stats. Won't affect my business. My value is not in stats but in interpretation of those stats. Car dealers used to have little black books and hid values. No more. A lot of agents, in my opinion, want to keep sales stats from public to substantiate their commissions. Don't have to do that. Your value is showing them how to get TOP dollar for their homes and save as much as possible on their buy and give a ton of advice to them to help them make the best decisions they can. Some of my commissions are even higher than average cause I offer to do more for them. Love the opportunity to evolve the business.
  • Rod Doris | 01 May 2015, 12:47 PM Agree 0
    There always two sides to every story. Have a read of this article before you spew your take on things!
  • Greg | 01 May 2015, 12:51 PM Agree 0
    Its about time Canada has a U.S. Zillow style information source for the public instead of this Nazi led MLS system .
  • Sorry | 01 May 2015, 01:09 PM Agree 0
    Sorry. End result is eventually this data will move towards accessible public knowledge as it should be. I know this upsets an industry of high-school graduates that are climbing over each other to make the equivalent of a year's salary for signing some paperwork, but you need to work around this reality as other agents have around North America. Your work effort hasn't scaled proportionately with the market demand that has inflated home prices and even ***your own licensing body*** won't limit or restrict the number of new agents flooding the market every year.

    What is my point? You are happy to collect a massive unwarranted commission based on real estate values that have resulted from ***open market competition***. But then when you "perceive" that same open market competition info might work against your industry (open publication of something as simple as sold data prices).... you all of a sudden are "protectionist".

    Make up your mind. Do you want the benefits of open market competition or not? You won't have it both ways.

    And for the lamewads who want to cite "WE BUILT THIS SYSTEM OVER DECADES!"

    No.... no you didn't. You didn't build anything. You didn't pay into anything. It came off the backs of home sellers and home buyers. You were along for the ride scraping a vig off the top. Your commissions came off of buyers and sellers. Your fees forwarded to TREB/CREA/OREA, etc, etc came off the backs of the buyers and sellers.

    And look at the "minutes of the meetings" from past decades at the AGMs. There was a giant segment of licensed agents who were against the foundation of to begin with.

    Is it because you have a short memory? No, it's not the short memoery. You weren't even *around* for that fiasco 20 years ago. That was back when you were still working your B.S. office job that you bailed on because you didn't like a structured work routine and thought being an agent would be easy money.

    So enjoy. Because now you are competing in the age of the Internet with the agent who also works part-time at Subway.

    Now stop trolling these message forums and go back to pirating episodes of Games of Thrones because you don't want to pay for HBO.
  • Rod Doris | 01 May 2015, 01:14 PM Agree 0
    The operative phrase is: "Sold Data!" Who owns it this data, and why should it be for-profit? We REALTORS have all given our clients this information for "free" anyways. So, why should an one individual make money on the very information that we have gathered, streamlined, and have spent MILLIONS dollars in all our dues over the years, to be used as a profit center? This formidable database should only be used by people who work in the industry that created and maintained it. That's my take... I dare you all to use you real name, and to come out from behind the shroud of being anonymous.
  • | 01 May 2015, 02:37 PM Agree 0
    Don't all agents use sold data when they prepares a CMA? If they do, are they not using the sold date for their personal gain. I never prepare a CMA for someone else's benefit. Taking the position that sold data should never be release is a an indefensible position.
  • Peter B. | 01 May 2015, 03:11 PM Agree 0
    It's gotten to the point where we have to redefine the issue. If I take an ad that states "area homes are up 3.4% over the same period last year", am I breaking the rules? Or are we talking about more specific information on area sales data (semi-det homes sold and average prices?
    I don't think using this data is an issue in a general advert but giving away all of the sales data is cutting our own necks.
    The definition is becoming more difficult to define.
    Realtors did pay for this info and no, "sorry" is wrong and more than a little insulting with his/her comments but agents did pay for the info however you look at it.
    I may have contradicted myself on this issue simply because it is become way too fuzzy.
    Prior to writing another story on this issue, how about if the writer defines the issues so we can all be on the same page?
  • Claire Parker | 01 May 2015, 07:54 PM Agree 0
    Yes the business is ever revolving, however, the data in the MLS system belongs each and every realtor who has put data in the system to share with other realtors..NOT ONE is valuable to the realtors inorder to serve their client base. If you want to give it to the public then 100% of the realtors have to agree. When did Boards, Brokers and their respective partnerships make up our minds. It's all about MONEY nothing has changed on the planet. If we realtors do not stand up and fight for what is ours we will wake up one morning and not own our data that was collected with blood, sweat and tears over the years.
  • Consumers Payed for the Data | 03 May 2015, 10:41 AM Agree 0
    Typical Realtors think they paid for the DATA info..It was the consumer/public who payed for all this info with the HIGH COMMISSION RATES WE PAYED!! Realtors would not exisit if it wasn't for consumers not the other way around. Time for the Ego of realtors to understand they exisit because of us and WE PAYED FOR THE DATA AND WE SHOULD HAVE ACCESS TO IT WHENEVER
  • Doug King | 03 May 2015, 02:30 PM Agree 0
    It's a bit funny to me that REP seems to 'exist' only in Contrario. Here in Alberta, Sold data...days on market, original list price, list at sale and sale price, as well as commissions are all data used by all competent Realtors as part of any decent CMA. Yes, your Contrario boards have deemed it illegal. UNDEEM IT! Be transparent. Get on with the business of providing the best service with the best data and show your professionalism!!
  • EddieN | 03 May 2015, 06:38 PM Agree 0
    REP, thank you for quoting me and calling me "irate", which I'm not. But let's take the subject one step further. A property sale goes firm and one of these jokers sends out "sold" data the next day. Closing is supposed to take place in 90 days but for whatever reason, it doesn't. So, three months later the property is back on the market but now the sellers can't get a price anywhere close to the incomplete deal. The question are: 1. Was the service provided to the public useful and correct, or was this actually a disservice? 2. Is the public now going to be informed and updated about this property? The answer is most like a big, fat NO. This is why disseminating information carries with it a lot of responsibility. Sending out random "sold" data is irresponsible and careless. Not to mention that the mls data a a tool designed by and for agents ONLY
  • Matt | 04 May 2015, 12:56 PM Agree 0
    "Consumers Paid for the Data"...ummm, I've heard this argument come from so many people that are a bit disillusioned. You didn't pay for any data when you paid commission to a real estate office, you paid to have your house sold. Period. AND, you only paid if you got the results!

    Like any other business or industry, the "company" doesn't OWE anything to it's consumers beyond what the consumer has paid for. Ultimately any company grows and becomes better when it offers better service and value to its target customer demographic, but what service is offered is the decision of the company...not a self entitled customer.

    If you don't like how a particular company does business, you have options to go in different directions, real estate being no exception to this.
  • Tour Guide | 04 May 2015, 01:21 PM Agree 0
    Tour Guides,

    Company doesn't owe anything to consumers !!!?? No wonder their is so much talk about commission wars when egos like that send messages to the consumers!! No wonder their is so much in-fighting with these realtors...few egos act like they invented the wheel. Tell the stock brokers from the 80's ,travel agents ask them too!!! When the consumers speaks it all ends badly when someone is greedy or act like their system is the holy grail!!! Consumers are finally waking up that paying someone to tour guide,taxi $20,000-$50,000 is just outrageous
    Prices of homes have inflated very fast but the agents service,skill has stayed the same. Every part of the real estate world fees have basically stayed the same or went down. Lawyers,stagers, assistants, advertisers,
  • Matt | 04 May 2015, 01:52 PM Agree 0
    Tour Guides, I've seen your posts on several articles, and they all sound the same. You obviously don't know what the role of a REALTOR is, and have some kind of chip on your shoulder. What is it? Did you pay too much to have your house sold? Go for a private sale that went sour? Tried to get into the industry and failed? Whatever it is, this lens that you see real estate professionals through is a bit askew.

    What exactly would you like to see happen, and how do you feel it will benefit you, exactly?
  • Commission Wars | 04 May 2015, 02:28 PM Agree 0
    Ur insight on my experiences is overwhelming!!!

    I f u read my replies : be fair and charge what the service is real worth!!(1,000-2,000 tops) All that high commission has done is created a war internally with ur own colleagues, making consumer irrate for paying for a service that is the same for 40 yrs. U Took advantage of ur high commission when the prices of real estate sky rockected/. This debate is happening because many consumers are seeing the light and why COMMISSION WARS is happening. Everyone has to eat and when they see what they payed and the value they got for it later I am sure Irrate consumers feel duped. Go buy a car and if you overpayed u feel so good after!!! Uber is fighting taxi service ..ur turn is coming !!!

    Stock brokers got their beating for costs they were charging,travel agents etc... Consumers want value ..easy to take advantage of emotiions and consumers who have bought their first home or just one...they are not as educated the value they are getting..

    if u had less agents, sell more at 1000-2000 and in the end you would make the same...but of course u like the taxi/tour service and collect 20,000-50,000...who wants to work harder!!!?? I think it is coming in a big way...all these agents paying dues/fees for a legal team to hold on to the precious data for the agents who like ego and easy money..

  • Matt | 04 May 2015, 08:23 PM Agree 0
    We, you're mistaken on a few key points here.
    1. There may be real estate professionals at odds, but one side is in the overwhelming minority, none of which trade anywhere close to me. I haven't seen any of this in house fighting that you're describing.
    2. Not a single one of my clients have ever felt that I've over charged them, several of which have written testimonials describing their experiences, how happy they are, and the value that was provided. (I close 40-50 deals a year for clients).
    3.NEVER have I seen a $20,000, let alone a $50,000 cheque! Most Realtors don't. Step outside the top 3 or 4 city centres that the media focuses on and you'll find a very different industry (and perhaps attitude?).

    I'm glad that you find my insight overwhelming, I wasn't sure if you'd catch my keen eye, even though you've made your stance very clear. Over and over again.
  • Crystal BALL REALTORS | 05 May 2015, 12:00 PM Agree 0
    You silver tongue realtor you keep milking those clients. Ur crystal ball must be special....

    look up availability,comparables...take a break.,check crystal ball , break..TAXI ,TOUR, break , offer... new suit!!

    How in the world could a client navigate buying/selling without realtors!!?? So complicated...this Condo has 4 walls, status certificate and my crystal ball feedback..sign here.. this house has will have bidding wars ,no conditions whatsoever, I tell you 20 people are buying it anyway..

    So I am not responsible if any issues..good luck thx...if the market collapses don't send any flattering crystal balls fault
  • DJD | 07 May 2015, 12:00 AM Agree 0
    These posts will be interesting reading in the years to come. Sale price information is available to the public in Ontario. It will find it's way to the public for free. That time is not very far away. Google 'Zillow' and observe the future.
  • Change to the tour | 08 May 2015, 07:47 AM Agree 0
    More interesting would be to start charging agents for the use of my personal information ie. the sold price of my home!! They whine how sacred it is to safeguard but will hand it out like candy to anyone who may list or buy a home. When signing over our data for their use lets start charging them. They have to call home owners for permission and pay us a fee if they hand it out. Getting permission and using it should be $2500 per time.
  • Peter B. | 14 May 2015, 08:22 AM Agree 0
    One "comment" stated that our service is worth 1000-2000 tops. Really? For 7 years of liability and worry? So, by your logic, a lawyer working on the closing for a total of 30 minutes deserves $900 (plus disbursements of course)?
    Am I a tour guide? No. I have "fired" buyers for wasting my time. I have also "fired" myself from a few buyers that needed attention I was not able to give. Integrity is the key. I take my career seriously. Sometimes, a home will sell in a week. Other homes will take months (I am in a rural area and no, the world does NOT revolve around Toronto, Vancouver and Calgary. Land can take a year to sell and so-on and so-forth. Taking a "mobile" home with a market price of around $50,000 and essentially using all of my "massive commission of 1.5%" towards marketing fees. What am I left with, exactly? A happy seller and "0" profit but that's part of the job.
    if you are so convinced you can make a consistent $20,000 per shot for doing minimal work, get your license and get to it. You are obviously much smarter than the majority of agents in Canada, who, I think, make less than around $40,000 per year. (someone correct me on that as it is difficult to find accurate numbers on this point but i believe this is fairly close).
  • Matt | 14 May 2015, 10:45 AM Agree 0
    Peter, you're spot on. I don't know where the perception of a "tour guide" comes from, but it's obviously not from research or any legitimate sources (if I'm wrong, please pass on any citations).
    I work 60 hours a week average. I make a comfortable living, but not a wealthy one, by any stretch of the imagination.

    This whole argument is ridiculous. One side is trying to protect an industry of jobs, privacy of their clients (the general public!), and maintain integrity that's in the best interest of said general public.
    The other side has some kind of chip on its shoulder, is rude, misinformed, and honestly, I have no idea how it's been given any credit at all.
  • Sold Data Fee | 14 May 2015, 06:10 PM Agree 0
    Sold Data holders,

    Consumers want to be paid when u use our personal sold price information for ur own benefit. We pay a substantial commission for all agents and want to be compensated. Agents say they are safe guarding it but hand it out like candy to anyone they can make a commission off of. Agents aren't lawyers,engineers,architects,surveyors,accountants who spent a a lot more schooling and sure don't make anywhere near what agents charges each client ..whether they do a lot a work or little...same in every field some do more work or have less clients etc ...but the only part of the real estate trade is the tour guide that charges the most for their service.

    Consumers stop signing those listing agreements that give agents the INFO FOR FREEEEE!!! Might be ok to sign if u find one of the many great agents that will list or sell u a house for $1000-$2000 if the agents is charging you a large commission tell him/her you want $5000 for use of ur sold data of ur home
  • Matt | 14 May 2015, 06:49 PM Agree 0
    You ARE being compensated for the commission you pay. You get your house sold. What about that are you not getting?
  • Commission Wars | 15 May 2015, 09:55 AM Agree 0
    What part are u not getting? I paid to sell my house and NOW I want to be paid if agents use my personal sold info.

    Consumers no wonder the Competition bureau is on our side these tour guides want it everyway they can. ANd consumers pay for it ALLLLL

    Remember have walls,windows and a status certificate what else can the agent tell you!!!??? They don't have a crystal ball,no guarantees.. detached/semis there are bidding wars,called eco 101 supply and demand ..what does the agent do that could justify 4-5%???

    Please, I have asked this question 100 times and never get a answer that justifies it!? they will whine we work hard do a lot of people like lawyers who close these deals, stagers, assistants, advertisers etc...but their wages/fees stayed the same and even went down!!! the only fees that went up were realtor commissions!!!!!! Because house prices went up not the value or service of agents!!!!! Wake -up consumers and keep ur money for ur own kids ,expenses etc..
  • John P | 15 May 2015, 10:41 AM Agree 0
    That personal sold info that you're bemoaning is worth $7. How does that tie in again to your other whining? If you think it's so easy to do the job of a real estate agent, and you think they're making so much money, why is it that you're not licenced? Oh yeah, because you're talking out of your @$$.

    (I'll patiently wait for your response that will go along the lines "because I have integrity, and I would NEVER sell my soul to the devil!!")
  • Matt | 15 May 2015, 10:46 AM Agree 0
    Commission Wars (or Tour Guides, or whatever), you're crying over nothing, and obviously no one else is listening to you or taking the bait. I'm sorry I did. You don't seem able to listen, and have made it clear that you don't want to engage in reasonable debate, so I'm done. Have a nice day :)
  • UBER REALTY TRANSACTIONS | 15 May 2015, 11:09 AM Agree 0
    you sure are listening and I feel ur pain knowing I am right...said before, if u can milk ur clients into paying those fees for a tour service go for it Matty

    again the tour guides have not answered the question on justifying their 4-5% FEES when all other parts of their industry has stayed the same or went down in costs!!!

    Matty, surprised with all the comparable looking up u even had time today to come on here? If you do come back please come up with some real evidence on why u are worth 4-5% commission. And tell me why other parts of ur industry fees/wages stayed the same or went down...?
    Did u buy a new crystal ball made of special crystals?

    John P I think u got something there ..the uber of real estate tranasaction should be $7 when we get a uber app for that.. ilike it...where a offer is made, goes to a lawyer for quick review etc...all virtually. All we need is a tour guide/taxi service to take us to the property escpecially condos...DINGY..current realtors have that skill ur employment is safe!!

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